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Old 01-08-2009, 11:09 PM   #1
Jayvier
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Default Questions on Fuel Consumption/Maintainence

Hi Everybody,

I am new to the forum and would like you guys to advice what is the actual fuel consumption of the 1.6THP AUTO model cos been
thinking of getting this car for my new ride cos cannot really trust the manufacturer's specs.

Also,what is the difference between the AUTO and EGS model?Lastly can the car be serviced outside easily like Japanese cars whereby the parts are easily available?Cos been driving Japanese cars all over the cars,not too sure about maintainence fees for a European cars.Thanks for the advice!!!
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Old 01-08-2009, 11:50 PM   #2
voyager
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Default Re: Questions on Fuel Consumption/Maintainence

hello Jayvier :-)

a warm welcome to you.

i cannot comment meaningfully on the consumption of the THP, as i don't own one, but i can help a bit with the question about difference in type of gearbox (as for your question about servicing, there is a person whose name is Thomas, where some of us (not me, so i cannot comment meaningfully again) send our cars. to find more about Thomas, just enter the keyword 'Thomas' in the built-in search engine in this forum :-)

the Auto gearbox and the EGS gearbox.
both have the facility to shift gears by themselves, without driver intervention. both also allow the driver to manually override gear selection, should there be a need to and / or should the driver feel so inclined.
the easiest way to think about their differences is to think about the Auto as a 'conventional' automatic gearbox - the sort of gearbox you would find in the majority of cars (japanese and european) which are marketed as having gearboxes which shift for themselves. the EGS, on the other hand, is essentially a manual gearbox without a clutch pedal (the clutch pedal is not needed as the car will de-clutch itself).

now, i fully acknowledge that the preceding paragraph would make little sense to someone who does not know much about how gearboxes work, and for that, i apologise, because gearboxes are an exceedingly complicated part of the car, especially those which have the facility to engage gears without driver intervention.

as an example, take the gears on a bicycle. you can easily see that there are many moving parts and parts of different sizes. now try to scale up this level of complication into the parts required to feed the much greater power and torque that a turbocharged car can generate (as compared to a bicycle) and you'll have an idea of the complexity. further, in the case of the bicycle, the rider changes gears manually and the bicycle itself cannot. but in a car which can change gears by itself, it is therefore even more complicated internally.

a conventional automatic gearbox (the Auto gearbox) is less energy efficient (ie, more fuel-consumptive) than a manual gearbox (and therefore, than an EGS gearbox, which - you'll remember - can be thought of as a manual gearbox without a clutch pedal) - there is a stage when the engine's torque is transmitted through the drivetrain (on its way to driving the wheels) through a bowl of hydraulic fluid (no such bowl can be found on a car with a manual gearbox, instead, there is a device consisting of springs and friction-plates).

from the end-user's (driver's) point-of-view, that might well be the key difference, because it results in (a) poorer fuel consumption in a conventional automatic gearbox relative to a manual gearbox, and (b) relatively slower acceleration rates in a conventional automatic gearbox relative to a manual gearbox, and (c) all other things being equal, a relatively smoother gearchange in a conventional automatic gearbox relative to a manual gearbox (provided the latter is left to making upshifts and downshifts by itself, as opposed to having the driver intervene).

i know what i have written is potentially very confusing, so please let me know which if i need to further elaborate :-)

once again, welcome to the community here :-)
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Old 01-08-2009, 11:57 PM   #3
Jayvier
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Default Re: Questions on Fuel Consumption/Maintainence

Hi Voyager,

Thanks for the in depth explanation.Really appreciate that,cos I am considering which model to go for thou the Auto model will have a smoother gear change like a CVT,correct me if I am wrong.Only drawback is the fuel consumption.But I suppose the EGS gear box will be easier to maintain?Will probably decide after getting more info on the fuel consumption cos I really fell in love with this car after seeing it last week.

Been looking at Wish,Stream,Isis etc but frankly speaking,this is the model I would love to own.Thanks again for taking your time to reply.
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Old 02-08-2009, 12:16 AM   #4
voyager
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Default Re: Questions on Fuel Consumption/Maintainence

hello Jayvier

i am very happy to be online concurrently as you, to be able to give you such a quick turnaround.

the CVT will be the smoothest of all, as the C V stands (rightly so) for Continuously Variable.

so, this is actually a third type of gearbox, where there are no mechanical gears at all, let alone bowls of hydraulic fluid.

CV gearboxes used to operate (back in the 1960s) on bands of rubber wrapped around a system of pulleys, but recent CV gearboxes use chains instead of rubber, i believe.

in fact, CV gearboxes can potentially have been so smooth that the gear ratios were artificially preprogrammed in back in the early 1990s, to give the car a more 'conventional' feel, so as not to put off the driver. these are virtual gear ratios, as there are no gears in a CV gearbox.

(in a proper CVT, during hard acceleration, the engine revs would go up to an amount (say, 4000 rpm), and then stay there (provided the accelerator pedal was being pressed with constant pressure) and then the car would 'catch up' with the engine (so, the speedometer needle would wind its way around the dial, but the tachometer needle wouldn't move; this is quite different from the usual experience of having the tachometer rise, peak, fall, rise, peak, fall in a normal gearbox with true gears)) it was disconcerting to many drivers because it sounded as if the car had what is known as a slipping clutch (which is usually a sign that of major problems).

the Wish, Stream, Isis, if you analyse them, you'll find one important difference between those three and the C4, and that is those three were not designed to be sold in Europe. crash safety regulations and environmental regulations are a lot more rigorous in Europe than elsewhere. (not to mention the usual argument being trotted out in favour of European cars, and that is namely that they are designed to be stable even at high speed since there are still no speed limits on certain stretches of the autobahn in Germany)

so, back to your question. the CVT will have the smoothest gearchange, followed by the Auto, then the EGS. however, i have read on these forums that some EGS owners say that by manually using the gearshift lever (or paddles) to initiate a gearchange, the changes are pretty smooth too. also, in all fairness to you, french fully-Auto gearboxes are not the smoothest, as compared to the japanese competition (generally speaking). however, having owned the cars that i have owned (listed in my signature), and having driven recent Citroens (C5, Grand C4 Picasso, and C6 (latter with 6-speed)), i can vouch for the fact that the gearchange algorithms in the fully Auto have significantly improved to a level where they are more or less on par with the competition (other fully Auto gearboxes from other manufacturers).

again, in fairness to you, the Auto gearbox you'll be getting is a four-speed, i think. this means (just like in a bike) that the engine will have to be working relatively harder at any given vehicle speed, as compared to a car with a gearbox with more speeds (such as five, six; there are cars with seven and eight speeds but those are not in your shortlist, i think).

regarding the ease of maintenance of the EGS vis-a-vis the Auto, i honestly am not sure which one might be easier. i believe (though i may be wrong) that an Auto would be more expensive to replace than an EGS (because it is more complicated). you must weigh this against the fact that the Auto you'll be getting is a tried and tested (ie, robust) component used in many, many french cars over the past several years (not just Citroens), as compared to the generally more recent technology of the EGS.

if the Citroen is the model you "would love to own", then go with it. i have always gone with my heart, and have never regretted my choices (i haven't stuck exclusively to Citroens, by the way, and for my next car i might well try something else because i'll be following my heart :-) )
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2015 C4 Cactus 1.2
2016 (2014) C4 Picasso 1.6 e-HDi
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Old 02-08-2009, 12:26 AM   #5
Jayvier
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Default Re: Questions on Fuel Consumption/Maintainence

Thanks again for your reply.Guess you are right at times,we should follow our heart.For this case,it is much easier to make a choice since I fell in love with this model at the very first time.But got to consider the budget and how much I can get for my existing car,no choice,got to be practical at times :-)

Not too sure if they have both Auto and EGS model to test drive.Side track a bit,does the Singapore model come with the cruise control?
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Old 02-08-2009, 12:34 AM   #6
voyager
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Default Re: Questions on Fuel Consumption/Maintainence

yes, i believe it will have cruise control (best to counter-check, of course :-) ), as i do not represent CnC :-)

what i personally find more valuable than the cruise control (and is a feature i wish more manufactuers would have) is the speed limiter (not speed warning device, but speed limiter).

what i do is i set the speed limiter to the expressway speed limit, and then i don't have to worry about inadvertently exceeding the speed limit, because even if i were to press the accelerator pedal, the car would regulate its speed to not exceed the selected limit.

:-)
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2003 C5 2.0
2005 C4 1.6 (dad's)
2006 C5 2.0
2010 C5 2.0 WiFi
2013 DS 5 1.6THP WiFi
2015 C4 Cactus 1.2
2016 (2014) C4 Picasso 1.6 e-HDi
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Old 02-08-2009, 12:38 AM   #7
Jayvier
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Default Re: Questions on Fuel Consumption/Maintainence

Will definitely drop by C & C one of the days to check it out and clear my doubts.Looking forward to join this community as a proud C4 owner!
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Old 02-08-2009, 12:45 AM   #8
voyager
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Default Re: Questions on Fuel Consumption/Maintainence

keep us informed, please :-) and more importantly, don't hesitate to continue asking to clear your questions.

we're a pretty open group, and you'll always be welcome here regardless of what car you drive :-)
__________________
2003 C5 2.0
2005 C4 1.6 (dad's)
2006 C5 2.0
2010 C5 2.0 WiFi
2013 DS 5 1.6THP WiFi
2015 C4 Cactus 1.2
2016 (2014) C4 Picasso 1.6 e-HDi
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Old 02-08-2009, 01:20 AM   #9
Pug308
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Default Re: Questions on Fuel Consumption/Maintainence

I drive a 308 THP. My avg consumption is 10.5-11km/L, 50/50 highway/city.

Our avg in the club is ard 9.5km/L. Depends on driving style and traffic conditions.
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Old 02-08-2009, 10:50 AM   #10
cars2cars
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Default Re: Questions on Fuel Consumption/Maintainence


All Citroen passenager vehicle come with Cruise control and Speed limiter.
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